Trump vs Clinton

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by ProDeo, Mar 16, 2016.

  1. Liquid Tension

    Liquid Tension No, it's NOT a fish!!!

    I guess we'll agree to disagree. Conservatives will always be around. It's the GOP that, I believe, the country may be done with. But that's their own fault. If they put out better candidates, I'm sure the base would be excited about supporting them/him/her. But there were 17 clowns, and Trump won the race to the bottom.

    If a better candidate were presented, I'd more than likely would've done what I've almost have always done and supported and voted for the GOP nominee, especially against someone like Hillary.

    But oh well, you (general) get the leadership you (general) deserve
     
  2. IMINXTC

    IMINXTC Time Bandit

    Tremendous post 8)
     
  3. devilslayer365

    devilslayer365 Wazzup?!

    Well, I guess you're right; we'll have to agree to disagree. Of course conservatives will always be around. I never indicated that they wouldn't be. I'm saying that they'll never win the Presidency again. There's been a major shift in this country the last couple of decades towards liberalism in the culture at large, particularly the last 10 years or so. I just don't see a conservative President ever again, regardless of who it is or how good they look to conservatives. Many supposed conservative people moaned and groaned about how horrible Obama was as President and many of those same people are now going to elect Clinton, who is as bad as, if not worse than, Obama when it comes to being a liberal politician. Like I said, conservatives will never be in the White House again. I dislike liberals and their mindset so much I would rather have a big mouth like Trump in the White House instead. Clinton scares the hell out of me. She's evil. I think it will become evident within a fairly short amount of time to a lot of people who voted for her, within a year at most, that it was a mistake to elect her. But, by then it's too late and the damage will be done. Like you said, people will get the leadership they deserve...
     
  4. tango

    tango ... and you shall live ... Staff Member

    I think if we think of "conservatives" as people who look for a small government and an increased sense of self-reliance I think that would resonate with younger people. The general sense I see among people who support left-leaning policies is a sense that those on the right are some combination of smug/hateful/greedy etc.

    It's curious that the people who would naturally take advantage of tax breaks for themselves are quick to criticise others (individuals or corporations) for doing the exact same thing. If people see that the problem isn't the company that took advantage of the tax break, the problem isn't the person who was merely better at playing the game than they are, the problem is the government that writes a tax code so complex that even its own helpline doesn't know what the form means and it runs to many thousands of pages. The problem is the government that has grown so large the people within it are well placed to take all sorts of backhanders and promises to pass legislation that favors this group or that group, at the expense of everyone else.

    A lot of the time right-leaning policies that avoid mandating things like paid family leave etc come across as hateful or discriminatory - largely, it would appear, due to the perception that "companies" are rich and not giving workers paid family leave is merely exploitative. But when people run their own business and realize that mandated family leave means that, even though they only have one employee, when that employee claims their right to time off they get to pay the employee for not doing anything while also paying someone else to do the work that can't wait, they come to see it's not just about greed but about making sure there's a job for the employee to return to once their leave is finished. It's easy for MegaCorp inc to hire a couple of temporary workers to cover crucial staff but the mom-and-pop business on the corner doesn't have an HR department to process that sort of thing, nor does it have eight figures in cash to hand out like candy when someone wants their leave. If specific benefits are mandated it actually removes the flexibility a company has to offer a benefits package suited to each individual worker. If you have kids you might be thankful for paid family leave. If you don't have kids you might prefer the freedom to work four 10-hour days instead of five 8-hour days and get a free day off every week to go hiking. If you're saving up for something specific you might like the freedom to work six 10-hour days, or pick up the slack when others are taking time off, to earn the extra money and would rather have an extra $2500 on your salary than annual leave, or at least the freedom to turn unused vacation time into cash at the end of the year.

    I suspect the fact millennials are looking to Johnson rather than Hillary could be down to two reasons. It's entirely possible the issue is Hillary rather than the Democratic platform, but if that were the case I'd expect them to flock to the green party rather than the libertarians. Alternatively it could simply be that the libertarians are seen as more inclusive - with Hillary's comment about deplorables and all the vitriol thrown by supporters of both major parties at supporters of the other major party it's easy to see why voters of all ages are sick of the Punch and Judy show and are looking to politicians who act in a more statesmanlike manner. If you've got Trump apparently talking as if women are little more than playthings, Hillary talking as if voting for anyone other than her is indicative of a single-digit IQ, and A. N. Other wanting to talk about the issues facing the country then it's easy to see why people would express more interest in A. N. Other.
     
  5. teddyv

    teddyv The horse is in the barn. Staff Member

    I've heard a few things from Jill Stein of the Green Party and she sounds like a kook. I know virtually nothing about the rest of the party. I suspect your first reason is the likely reality.
     
  6. IMINXTC

    IMINXTC Time Bandit

    Correction: If neither candidate garners 271 electoral votes, the Legislature votes on the top 3.

    Edit:270 electoral votes.
     
  7. RabbiKnife

    RabbiKnife Open the pod bay door, please HAL. Staff Member

    Actually, it only takes 270.

    Total number is 538.

    One for each house seat, one for each senate seat.
    Washington, D.C., gets 3.

    So 269/269 is a tie.

    Takes 270 to win.
     
  8. IMINXTC

    IMINXTC Time Bandit

    Corrected.
     
  9. IMINXTC

    IMINXTC Time Bandit

    Here in Roseville, CA, it's big-paw trucks in full regalia and Trump, Pence posters.

    The Bay Area (going this pm) is all dump-Trump.

    My doc has been suggesting meds.
     
  10. devilslayer365

    devilslayer365 Wazzup?!

    It's probably just as well. Everybody knows the Ice Queen will win anyway. I can't wait until she comes up with more ways to tax us all so that her socialism, I mean social programs, have the means to be funded and the "lesser among us" can get their handouts, I mean assistance, and improve their lives at our expense, I mean with our heartfelt cooperation...
     
  11. tango

    tango ... and you shall live ... Staff Member

    On the top 3?

    I read something on one of Gary Johnson's Faceache posts that suggested that by winning New Mexico outright he could, in theory, take the White House. From what you're saying it sounds like there might be some truth in that - if he takes 5 of the votes and the rest of the states split such that neither Killary nor Chump gets their 270 votes and he ranks third (presumably in either the popular vote or EC votes) maybe it is conceivable that the legislature would elect him.
     
  12. Liquid Tension

    Liquid Tension No, it's NOT a fish!!!

    Johnson = kook
    Stein = kook
    Trump = super kook
    Clinton = liar and kook

    :.: 0:0 ;.;.
     
  13. teddyv

    teddyv The horse is in the barn. Staff Member

    I heard that in Utah there is an independent presidential candidate that is polling quite closely with Trump and Clinton - Evan McMullin.
     
  14. devilslayer365

    devilslayer365 Wazzup?!

    That is kind of interesting, but we all know that, in the big picture, it really doesn't mean anything.
     
  15. teddyv

    teddyv The horse is in the barn. Staff Member

    True enough. It is rare though to see third-party/independent candidates polling anywhere near the main two (although this appears limited to Utah only). However some decent polling/voting numbers for some of the other parties may actually lead people to think there might be some potential outside the big two.
     
  16. Liquid Tension

    Liquid Tension No, it's NOT a fish!!!

    Trump, the gift that keeps on giving..........

    http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/16/opinions/trump-tweets-snl-obeidallah/index.html

    If he could not get so unhinged and stay off of Twitter and keep his mouth shut more often, he wouldn't look so stupid. But this is where the deranged part of me wants him to win. There would just be sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo much comedy gold in a Trump presidency.
     
  17. devilslayer365

    devilslayer365 Wazzup?!

    Possibly, but let's be honest. Saturday Night Live hasn't been funny in several years. I agree it is time to retire the show.
     
  18. IMINXTC

    IMINXTC Time Bandit

    If Trump had stepped aside (at the urging of many), at the release of the video, it would have forced Pence into the top spot, salvaging the party and stimulating the election, though throwing the rules into confusion.

    If Pence would have stepped aside (as advised by many) at that critical juncture, it would have helped greatly to strengthen and restore the party down-ballet.

    Both Pence and Huckabee commenced to invoke the "Forgive and Forget" rhetoric, in effect tossing the party and the faith contingent under the bus.

    Power and position take precedence over principle and even party.

    Almost all GOP state office-holders who stood with Trump are now highly vulnerable.
     
  19. teddyv

    teddyv The horse is in the barn. Staff Member

    Does anyone think Trump is now actively trying to salvage his own campaign?
     
  20. Liquid Tension

    Liquid Tension No, it's NOT a fish!!!

    Salvage or sabotage??
     

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