The Unpardonable Sin

Discussion in 'Bible Chat' started by ProDeo, Oct 16, 2017.

  1. ProDeo

    ProDeo What a day for a day dream

    31 Therefore I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven people, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. 32 And whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

    I have been thinking why the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. I mean, the Holy Spirit is part of the Trinity, blasphemy against God is forgiven,
    blasphemy against Jesus is forgiven, why not against the Holy Spirit?

    An angle of incidence to find an answer to the why could be to reformulate: - blasphemy against the Spirit can not be forgiven instead of will not.

    Thoughts?
     
  2. פNIʞƎƎS

    פNIʞƎƎS Connoisseur of Memes Staff Member

  3. RabbiKnife

    RabbiKnife Open the pod bay door, please HAL.

    The unpardonable sin has always been and will always be not recognizing who God is.
     
  4. Kierkegaard

    Kierkegaard Life is not a problem to be solved Staff Member

    This, I'd say. It's not unpardonable because God refuses to pardon it; it's unpardonable because the individual doesn't want to be pardoned.
     
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  5. RabbiKnife

    RabbiKnife Open the pod bay door, please HAL.

    I agree.
     
  6. פNIʞƎƎS

    פNIʞƎƎS Connoisseur of Memes Staff Member

    Exactly. A complete denial.
     
  7. devilslayer365

    devilslayer365 Wazzup?!

    I think it’s deeper than that. The Pharisees that said Jesus was able to cast out demons by means of demons were guilty of the unpardonable sin, as Jesus bluntly stated. Why was the sin unpardonable? Well, for one, they knew Jesus was sent by God. Nicodemus, a Pharisee, told Jesus this in private. Thus, they were not deceived or in mere error when they said Jesus operated by the power of demons. They purposefully slandered Jesus, and the Holy Spirit, because they wanted to discredit Him so badly before the Jews in an effort to keep their control over the people. They felt like Jesus was “muscling in on their turf.” Apparently, when one is so actively opposed to God that they equate Him with the Devil in an effort to slander Him before others, God washes His hands clean of that person.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2017
  8. RabbiKnife

    RabbiKnife Open the pod bay door, please HAL.

    Except you won't find that in Scripture.
     
  9. devilslayer365

    devilslayer365 Wazzup?!

    So, the Pharisees DIDN’T slander Jesus or the Holy Spirit when they said it was the Devil that gave Jesus the power to perform miracles? They WEREN’T blaspheming the Holy Spirit? :rolleyes:
     
  10. devilslayer365

    devilslayer365 Wazzup?!

    I think it’s more “will not,” rather than “cannot.”
     
  11. RabbiKnife

    RabbiKnife Open the pod bay door, please HAL.

    What does slander have to do with it. You are bringing that to the text.
     
  12. devilslayer365

    devilslayer365 Wazzup?!

    Slander: “the action or crime of making a false spoken statement damaging to a person's reputation.” When the Pharisees knowingly called the Holy Spirit “beelzebub” and falsely attributed His work to Satan, so that the Jews would think ill of Jesus, is that not slander?
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2017
  13. RabbiKnife

    RabbiKnife Open the pod bay door, please HAL.

    That's slander, but Jesus didn't say anything about slandering him or the Holy Spirit.

    He speaks of blasphemy, with is not slander.

    Blasphemy is a basic issue of mis-identification.
     
  14. devilslayer365

    devilslayer365 Wazzup?!

    Blasphemy has various meanings, one of which means “speaking ill of.” Which slander does. In the process of “slandering” the Holy Spirit, the Pharisees also “blasphemed” the Holy Spirit. Which the Bible says is “unforgivable.”
     
  15. RabbiKnife

    RabbiKnife Open the pod bay door, please HAL.

    I don't think anyon goes to hell for slander.

    What a pickaney God that would be.
     
  16. ProDeo

    ProDeo What a day for a day dream

    I had read that page before posting. It makes 2 interesting statements.

    #1. The Pharisees knew that Jesus was the Messiah sent by God to save Israel.

    It's probably a good guess, although they don't give a reference nor reasoning.

    #2. The blasphemy against the Holy Spirit, specific as it was to the Pharisees’ situation, cannot be duplicated today.

    One of those situations I disagree with them.
     
  17. ProDeo

    ProDeo What a day for a day dream

    I think will_not is the result of can_not in the sense of a catch-22 situation.
     
  18. ProDeo

    ProDeo What a day for a day dream

    I am choosing your side in this debate with the remark that calling a Member of the Trinity the total opposite of Him (the devil) is the Unpardonable Sin.
     
  19. devilslayer365

    devilslayer365 Wazzup?!

    Well, we’re not talking about ordinary slander. Blasphemy (which includes the slander the Pharisees were guilty of) against the Holy Spirit apparently DOES send one to hell. Matthew, Mark, and Luke discuss blasphemy against the Holy Spirit being unforgivable. With it being unforgivable, where else would people guilty of this sin end up?
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2017
  20. ProDeo

    ProDeo What a day for a day dream

    Once again -

    31 Therefore I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven people, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. 32 And whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

    While the mainstream interpretation is the Pharisees committed the Unpardonable Sin the technical reading of v31-v32 does not say that. Literal reading states the Pharisees blasphemed Jesus, not the Holy Spirit. If the mainstream interpretation is right after all then a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven [v32] can not be true because the Pharisees just disproofed it by speaking a word against the Son of Man.
     

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