Discussion in 'Controversial' started by ChristianInspiration, May 31, 2017.
Sounds like Ron was living out his faith, whether he knew the depths of it or not.
Sorry, didn't mean to trow your name in there Aaron. I was in a rush this morning.
We all have our own interpretations, but if you're a true believer in the core principles, that's what matters most. Those that shun those that don't believe 100% in what they believe in can be a rather harsh scenario. Not everyone will have the same view-points but you have to work with everyone to the best of your ability and hope you're following the right path.
Are you Christian yourself?
If all of the Bibles, Bible commentaries etc etc suddenly vanished existence the gospel would still be there as would faith and grace. People would still be born again and the Holy Spirit would still guide and reveal.
Yes, studying and learning as much as we can is very beneficial for Christians but we must remember that we don't worship the Bible we worship God. Someone could memorize the Bible but what good would it do them if they have no faith and relationship with Him?
Knowledge never hurts but it also never saves.
I don't want anyone to misunderstand me and get the impression that I'm saying "Don't bother reading your Bible." I'm not saying that at all. I'm just trying to put it in perspective.
If the relationship is foremost in your life then a great hunger and thirst for knowledge will naturally follow.
Great post Brian.
I'm curious to know what these "core principles" are. Is this from the point of view that as long as you follow the Golden Rule and are a good person, you don't have to really believe in God to get into the Kingdom? So often I hear people say that what matters most is being a good person and treating others with kindness and respect as if having a relationship with God is secondary to that.
On that point, it's too bad for all the 'Golden rule' people that Jesus practiced the platinum rule ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Or that it existed decades before Jesus...
Not wanting to be a party pooper, but let's assume the position of Brian's post, eliminate all Bible a and commentaries, etc. etc. There would still be faith and grace. People would still be regenerated/born again and the Holy Spirt would still guide and reveal.
If all Bibles and commentaries etc. etc. are eliminated, special revelation is nonexistent. All we have is natural revelation. What is it we are placing our faith in?
We are placing our faith not in an "It" but with God Himself.
In all of our studying, digging, discussion and debate sometimes some of us seem to forget the simplicity of the gospel. For the gospel is simple and it is God Himself that calls us not the word or Scripture.
We are saved by grace through faith, which is the gift of God so that no man can boast, yeah? All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God and it is only His redemptive work on the cross and His blood that was shed that paid the price for our sins and washed us clean of their stain.
I agree with all of that completely, Brian. We don't place our faith in an "it", but if all we have is natural revelation, what god are we placing our faith in? We can't look to natural revelation and even know who god is? We don't know about the Trinity without special revelation. Without special revelation, no one believes in grace. There was a time where you and I never read a line of Scripture. Where was I? Where were you? If you didn't have the Scripture, how different would the place be where you'd be at now compared with then?
Every religion except Christianity is a religion exactly like you described: without the Bible, commentaries, etc etc. Which of them have an accurate understanding of God? Which have an inkling of the idea of grace or faith or the Holy Spirit?
I'll agree except that I believe that natural revelation is sufficient to point man to the Creator, and that if they have no special revelation from the written word, that God is more than capable of either providing that special revelation supernaturally or to otherwise deal graciously with the situation.
Probably more prevalent in times past, as although there are still many unreached people groups, many of them at least have some extra-tribal communication with a society that has the Gospel.
I agree that natural revelation is sufficient to point man to the creator. I think natural revelation is sufficient to tell us that the world is broken in some way. It's not what it could or should be.
I don't think natural revelation gets us past generic theism.
Special revelation is needed. And he did supernaturally provide it, as you suggested he could do and did deal graciously as you suggested.
If he didn't give Scripture, some sort of special revelation would still be needed.
And then I find that "those that do the things of the law without the law..." section in Romans 2...
I agree. And everyone in Romans 2 is still lost as I read it.
Not a one of them because the world loves darkness instead of and more than the light of Christ. But God being God He would still be able to open hearts and remind people of who He is even without Scripture. We would still have the gospel, Christians and the Holy Spirit.
God doesn't have any boundaries or limitations.
I agree. But God obviously felt the Bible was something mankind actually needs. Otherwise, He wouldn’t have inspired it to be written...
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